MindForce: Mental Fitness & Life Stories!
Welcome to the show! We're on a mission to explore diverse perspectives and topics through podcasts and social media accounts. Tune in to 'MindForce' for insightful discussions on mental fitness and self-care strategies. Join us on 'Carer Stories' as we delve into the fascinating world of the Air Force, learning from professionals across various career fields and various other career stories. Follow us for engaging content and stay connected to broaden your horizons!
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MindForce: Mental Fitness & Life Stories!
Resilience in the Ranks: Josh White's Insights on Community, Gaming, and Overcoming Life's Obstacles
Embark on a profound journey with me, Nate Scheer, as I sit down with Josh White from the HeroFront Podcast, whose life lessons from a 19-year Air Force career have blossomed into a beacon of humor, motivation, and transparency. Reflecting on the power of genuine stories, we unearth the soul-stirring narratives that lurk behind the curtain of podcasting—a world where personal triumphs and tribulations eclipse the superficial glamor of celebrity.
Cue the nostalgia as we rewind to the heyday of Halo 3, where Josh and I bonded over the unifying force of gaming within the military community. It's not just about the high scores and tactical maneuvers; it's about the human connection, the shared laughter, and the collective resilience built from those late-night LAN parties and close calls with military curfews. These are the stories that forged unbreakable bonds and shaped us long after the controllers were put down.
As the conversation takes a turn towards the more somber lanes of life's highway, we're reminded that mental fortitude and community support are our greatest allies in navigating the stormiest of weather. From confronting the specter of nonexistence to recognizing the monumental impact of seemingly tiny 'two-inch decisions,' this episode is an ode to the healing power of sharing our struggles, the magnetic pull of positivity, and the courageous steps towards transformation. Join us as we celebrate the voices that echo our own experiences and the collective courage that propels us forward.
Thank you, hello. I'm your host, nate Shearer, and welcome to the show. This is Mindforce, the podcast for love, life and learning where your mind matters, still broadcasting from the lovely Killeen Texas, so please excuse the hotel room, but, as Josh can attest, when an opportunity comes, you take it or it'll pass you by. Today we have Josh White, the host of Hero Front Podcast, and this episode is all about podcasting. Welcome, josh.
Speaker 2:Hey man, I'm so happy to be here because me being here means you have a podcast right and I'm not usually a guest and to be on yours, especially after we talked about it so long ago and now we're here actually having an episode. It's amazing. So super proud of you and super happy that you're doing what you're doing. You're making the world a better place.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. Thanks for saying that. I got to drop the story real quick not to take up too much time, but I got to give two shout outs. One, chanel Meadow. She kind of pushed me off the ledge. She has her own dog treat business and she was like why not? So that was kind of getting pushed off the ledge.
Speaker 1:But then, as I was falling, I got a hold of Josh. I didn't think he'd really pick up you know he's a big, professional, successful podcaster, but still a nice humble human being Successful podcaster, but still a nice humble human being and took my call all the way around the world, pulled up his 10 top most listened to episodes, which was really powerful to me. I was thinking you have to have the biggest star. You got to have the secretary of the Air Force, you got to have some huge person, you got to have the biggest chief or whatnot. And then Josh, on the spot, pulled up the top 10 and was like it's all about the story and so that was just so powerful to me. And so, even though I was off the ledge, I knew that it would be okay, because the, the story of the people that is on the show is what's important, not the the name, the rank on the shoulder, but really the the story. So that's awesome. Okay, we're gonna move, move into the who, what, why, who are you? What do you do?
Speaker 2:And why are you here? So I'm Josh White from the Hero Front podcast, also an airman serving in the Air Force, been in 19 years, had a multitude of career fields aerospace, ground equipment, public health, commander's, exec and military funeral honors and why I'm here and this is a broad question, so I could be way off on what you're looking for and why I'm here is to man, have a great conversation with you about whatever you want to talk about. Man, I'm down for anything.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. We're going to go into some podcasting. Maybe we'll have to do another episode if I can squeeze another one in October. I know you're busy, but the focus of the podcast is mental health. But I do want to jump into a lot of podcasting here. So we're going to move into the warm up, kind of get some lighthearted questions, get this going. If you could describe yourself in three words, what would they be?
Speaker 2:Oh God, In three words I'd say Tenossum, Tenossum. Yeah, I'm just going to start cheating and just putting them together like that, just making them up. No, I would say comedic. And I say comedic because, you know, I had a therapist once tell me, if you can't laugh at yourself, then you're truly lost. And I was like you know what that's actually spot on. So that'd be my first one. My second one would probably be driven, and I say driven because I love having purpose in my life.
Speaker 2:And the times that I didn't have purpose in my life. I almost lost my life. So I'd say driven's the second one, and third would be transparent. So I'd say driven is the second one, and third would be transparent. And I'm transparent now because I want to share stories, your story, my story. But I never want someone to look at me and assume that it was all easy.
Speaker 1:I want people to know that happiness and purpose is something you have to work for, but it is possible, and so that would be my third one. That's awesome, that's a super powerful one. I always see the meme and it's in different ways, but it's the iceberg and it shows the success at the top of that iceberg. But then all the hard work down below, and so it is sometimes frustrating when people are like, oh, it must be nice, like, oh, no, not must be nice. I worked and got a lot of things long nights, early mornings or whatever it may be. So next question is which individual or individuals have had the most impact on your life?
Speaker 2:I'd probably say it has to be my dad first and foremost. So I'm fourth generation Air Force right, so this has been a part of my family and life since I can remember. But my dad raised me as a single father for a time and he was an airman kind of a rags to riches story. He was just a poor kid out of West Virginia, ended up enlisting, traveling the world and he ended up becoming an officer. He was also a 12 Outstanding Airman of the Year.
Speaker 2:A story that I heard time and time again growing up is like he was this superhero. That just changed his whole life and my career took a different path where it was full of trauma and struggles and really trying to figure out my place in the world. Of course, I never felt like I was living up to what my dad accomplished, which that kind of stung extra, but I have to say it all kind of culminated to me winning that exact same award, the same story that I heard my whole childhood when I was the same rank he was when he won it. As a matter of fact, on my coin rack is like his name for 12 Outstanding Gamer of the Year fell off his plaque because it's been so long so I took that and it's on my coin rack back there.
Speaker 1:That's awesome, and he's the first episode, so extra meaning on that one too he's the very first episode what's a fun or quirky fact about yourself that many do not know?
Speaker 2:I would say that I was a pro uh halo 3 player oh, bumper jumper.
Speaker 1:Oh, I had. What was it?
Speaker 2:oh yeah, I didn't like it at first, but it grew on me, dang.
Speaker 1:I've heard that's how you know someone's pro.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I did play Bumper Jumper. No, I was more of an online warrior because when this pro status happened, I was playing from Japan online. It was three airmen and one Marine and all of us were top 20 players worldwide. One, three airmen and one Marine and all of us were top 20 players worldwide. One of us was number two second online. So we're playing all these online tournaments and I got to say, out of all the tough times I had at Kadena, Halo 3 with the boys kind of saved me.
Speaker 2:That's all I had. The boys kind of saved me. That was kind of all I. That's all I had. So that's going to be a part of my life forever. But if I'll throw a little treat to the listeners here. So I lost all the footage, right, I used to have montages and all this stuff Lost my account. I had a team montage. He lost the account. Well, I hit the guy up who made the team montage and I had him send it to me. So I re-uploaded it, right.
Speaker 2:So, it's back on there. So if you search Halo 3 team departing sin, you will see our team montage from back in 2008, when we were just killing it funny.
Speaker 1:You mentioned that I remember in tech school in the dorms we had the land cable running down the hallway so we could, you know, not screen peek and all the land parties were, I mean, as nerdy as they were, were super fun, that's kind of unfortunate right. It's kind of a bummer. You don't get to hang out in the same room anymore, everyone's just at home.
Speaker 2:That's not the same yeah, I stopped playing first person shooters because it just taps into this addictive side of my brain, so I just had to let it go. But when I did play it oh my, the LAN parties were. I started in tech school as well and I got to say Halo 2, I started on Halo 2 in tech school and that was the first thing I was ever good at in my entire life. That's awesome.
Speaker 2:That's how you know you made it Truly one of the best, and so that's what drew me to it the teamwork, the communication, the friendships that you make and that I was actually good at something. I was making these videos and people liked it and I was like, wow, I've never had that before, until that game.
Speaker 1:That's awesome, were you so good? It wasn't fun to just beat your friends it was always fun.
Speaker 2:It never got old to beat anyone, it's always fun to win it is. There's always trash talk constantly. You're either really happy and laughing or you're really mad about the throw your controllers. It's either one or the other.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's awesome. Well, earlier you mentioned comedic, so I'd like to hear a funny story from your personal life. Hopefully, bmt, no, just kidding.
Speaker 2:I did see some stuff from BMT that was kind of wild.
Speaker 1:Oh, we all did.
Speaker 2:I went through the wild time of BMT.
Speaker 1:Like I joined.
Speaker 2:July of 2000. That's when I joined. So around July, august, that timeframe, bmt was in the news. Shortly after that, I mean, I was there when it was dangerous and I saw some stuff too. I mean, I went through the gauntlet, but I won't tell those stories. The story I will tell, though a funny story is how I almost got kicked out of my second base after my first weekend out.
Speaker 2:So I get to Kadena Air Base. I'm aerospace ground equipment. I just came from Guam. Guam was a piece of cake. We simulated everything. We drank, we barbecued, we did everything but work.
Speaker 2:I get to Kadena totally different story. They're like we're on 12s. Screw your feelings, I don't care what you got going on, you're on nights, you're on 12s, but I got, I don't, I don't care, shut up, go, go, go, do that, go, work. You know, um, the mission was everything. And I was like, wow, this is really different. Um, and so this guy, you know he, he was an older airman, which was a little bit more rare back then, a little bit older airman, and he, he was like hey man, you know, I'm going to show you the ropes, I'm going to show you around Like I got a skyline. You know we're going to hop in my car, I'll take you out. You know this is my first weekend, so I was like heck yeah.
Speaker 2:What I didn't know was is like this guy was getting kicked out, like he was already like done, like he had nothing to lose. I didn't know that. No one warned me about this guy. Okay, he takes me out. I know there's a curfew. Right, I'm not terrified of the curfew yet because I don't really know how bad breaking that curfew is. But the reality is it's really serious. And if you're an airman and you break that curfew, they get kicked out. You just don't see them again. They're doing like base details until they're separated. Okay, this is serious. And the party town was, uh, gate two street, it was. It was called gate two, and that whole street was nothing but bars. It was complete chaos. It was like pinocchio when he turns into a donkey. It felt like that anyways. So I go out, this guy and, um, you know, I'm in japan, I'm drinking, I'm at a karaoke bar, which is like normal there, but at the time I'm like that's kind of weird, but it kind of grew on me.
Speaker 2:Um, there's a lot of marines getting drunk, lots of girls there. You know, I'm a single airman at the time. So I'm like, hey, first weekend out, like full send. And there's these two japanese girls who clearly, you know, wanted to hang out with some american dudes and I was like, hey, that's me. So me and his name's Jeremy. We talked to these two girls and the one that I talked to I hit it off with. He was going great. The one he talked to completely despised him. He's a complete idiot. He was way too drunk and he goofed it.
Speaker 2:Well, he starts getting mad at me because mine's going well, right, so, like, he starts trying to like interfere with me and he's getting, you know, angry with me. And I'm like dude, is this guy like unstable or something Like, why are you yelling at me? Like you asked me to come with you. This is crazy. Well, it's getting close to the curfew again. I'm not used to paying attention to the time, but I noticed everyone starts, everyone's gone at some point, right, no one's in there. But like us four. And I'm like and the bartender's like, hey, you, if you're about to break curfew, like you should probably get in a taxi and I'm like, dude, oh my god, like what'll happen? Like, oh, you get kicked out. I'm like this is. And he's like I don't care, I'm already getting kicked out F this, f, the Air Force. I'm like, oh no, what have I done? It's my first weekend. No one even knows me.
Speaker 2:We go outside. He's like, chill, we're going to get in a taxi, we'll get on base. I'm about to get in the taxi and I look down at the gate, at the entrance. It's kind of far off, it's like 300 yards down and I see all these dudes like chiefs and senior NCOs and blues like coming onto gate two street. I'm like what is that? Like, oh yeah, they come out here and bust people you know and and they get kicked out. And I'm like, so they're doing. He's like, yeah, that's what they're doing.
Speaker 2:And I was like, well, we can't go now, it's too late. I was like we got to run, bro. I was like I am not going down like this, I am not losing my career because of this idiot dragged me out here and screwed up my night. I'm like we got to go, so I grab them. We run away. We're running through the streets. It's pitch black. I'm like can we get a hotel? Everything closes there. Like it's silent, everything's closed. You can't. I'm like, what are we gonna do? Like it's it's 12, you know when? Can I go back on base five, six? Like what? What do we sleep? Right?
Speaker 2:Meanwhile he has just lost his mind. I mean, he is so gone that he's like looking for his ex-girlfriend's house, to like yell at her and I'm like bro, where does she live? Like this is a big island. Like does she live on gate two street? Well, if not, then you're stop looking for her house. But that's how gone this guy was.
Speaker 2:So how I get through it? I find a ladder that goes up to a roof of a building. Mind you, I'm also been drinking, so I'm willing to like really hide in some anywhere I can. You know I'm feeling brave. We climb the ladder, we go all the way up in this like three story building on the roof I can't really see. But I noticed there's like this garden in the middle of this area. So we go into the garden on top of this roof and he just blacks out. I'm like, thank God, like go to sleep. So I just try to make myself comfortable. I'm just standing guard.
Speaker 2:Hours and hours go by, the sun starts to come out and I start to realize that we're on someone's property, right, like this garden was central to a bunch of apartments that went around it and that was kind of like their backyard of sorts. Right, they all shared that common area. Now, I don't know if you've ever been to Kadena, but Americans breaking into Japanese people's houses on accident because they're drunk happens every weekend and, trust me, you don't want to be that guy and I'm hiding in the bushes. There's Japanese dudes smoking cigarettes in the morning. I'm hiding in the freaking bushes thinking how is this my life right now? If this guy sees me, an American, hiding in his bushes at 5 am, that's an international incident Like this is going to go so south.
Speaker 1:So I try to keep him quiet. You're making the news Right.
Speaker 2:Well, I find a time where he starts to wake up and the people didn't look like they were watching. We split, we get down the ladder, get in a taxi, get back on base. And I was like bro, I am never hanging out with you ever again, you freaking psycho. And I did not get kicked out, I did not get caught and that is the story that's awesome.
Speaker 1:Okay, that is wild you weren't expecting that were you? You, no, I thought it was going to be funny, slightly embarrassing, like not you?
Speaker 2:know, trespassing. It kind of was all that. Yeah, I mean I feel like the statute of limitations is gone. It was 2008. So you know, I'm going to be sharing that story, you are absolutely cleared. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Okay, the last question we have in the warm up.
Speaker 2:If you could have dinner with any historical figure, who would it be and why? You know, I've I've been asked that before and I give a different answer every time. I don't know how anyone would not pick jesus. I feel like that would just answer. I feel like, but if you could, if you did pick jesus, it probably like collapsed the universe or something like. That's not supposed to happen.
Speaker 2:You probably like accidentally, oh snap. Okay, I'm gonna stick with my answer. I would pick jesus. You know I'd be taking a risk at ending it all because that should not happen, you know in the plan. But but I would talk to jesus because, uh, you know I was.
Speaker 1:I was just in israel not too long ago it wasn't my first it was probably like my fifth, but I don't know if you can, it's most meaningful.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, I got to be an embedded medic with the IDF. Of course my heart goes out to them now because I actually literally know these people, worked with them, saw how kind they were and how much they cared about their country and, um, but that that was just a absolutely life-changing moment. I thought about Jesus a lot, um, during that trip because you know, we went through the desert. There's a crazy terrain. It's like jungle to desert to ocean, like it's. It's a wild terrain over there.
Speaker 2:But I got to go to the Dead Sea in Masada, which is a famous Jewish temple up on a mountain, um, and on that drive I was looking out at the desert and I was thinking, like, because the path that Jesus walked was like all over the place, it was like hundreds of miles, and I was like how did one dude walking around this desert like because it's vast change the whole world forever? How is that even possible? Like that is just crazy. When you're there and you see it, it's kind of hard to wrap your head around how one person could change the world forever that long ago oh yeah, this guy in this book, but like you're saying, you're looking down and seeing the routes and things like that.
Speaker 1:Like that has to make it real, you know, no matter what you believe. Like that's pretty, pretty powerful and kind of makes it more concrete, which is super cool.
Speaker 2:Definitely.
Speaker 1:So yeah, that's who I'd pick, just because, for obvious reasons, so I was curious, speaking of meeting people, not that it was necessarily dinner, but how was meeting Simon Soneik? So?
Speaker 2:I got to have breakfast with him and the reason that happened was because I was a 12 Outstanding Airman of the Year that was like a gift to these award winners was that he came to Whiteman to talk to a bunch of people. He went all over the base, but we specifically got to have a breakfast with him and I thought the guy was a genius like I. I mean exactly like how he hits hard with like those little clips, like he basically did that for like an entire week, like he. He's just an, he's an amazing man and he's super humble, very approachable. Um, I got him to film a video on my phone. I had a buddy who should have been there but he was deployed. So I had him film a video to him saying he wishes he was there, he hopes he's safe, and literally did that for me on the spot. And then I sent that video to his name's Airman, monty, and he was like, oh my God. I was like, bro, you owe me forever for that. That's awesome.
Speaker 2:Whenever I need, and he was like, oh my god, I was like bro, you owe me forever for that. Like that's all. Whenever I, whenever I need you, you better be there because, holy cow, so I would love to meet him. That'd be great. Yeah, he's, he. He's got like an aura around him, just a really cool dude. Like I didn't want to stop hanging out with him. Like I was always sad when, like I had to like walk away. I, I just want to keep talking to them.
Speaker 1:It's good when they're, you know, nice and humble and approachable and things like that. So I'd be worried that some of the people you think would be really cool, like the rock you know certain people were like if they were not cool behind the scenes, it'd be so devastating.
Speaker 2:It would be yeah, and some of them are like that, unfortunately.
Speaker 1:Okay, we're going to move into the interview a little more heavier topics, but I want to give you a chance to ask me a question, to ask you a question.
Speaker 2:Okay, I guess a great question would be. You know, I don't think you ever really told me the purpose behind why this platform, this podcast, meant so much to you to put all this time and effort into actually starting it and following through with it. So I'd like to know where that comes from.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. I touched on it briefly in the pilot episode, but I lost my grandma to mental health and she was one of the nicest, most outgoing, helpful people I've ever met in my life. And so to see that she was struggling with such darkness and didn't feel that she had an outlet to be able to have a conversation, to ask for help I mean, all the grandkids are going to her funeral just completely confused like what, what just happened? And then come to find out she would lay in bed for a week or two at a time in these deep depressive states that we never knew. But if you know, we pass somebody on the side of the road, she would jump out and even if she didn't know how to fix a tire, she would try. She would talk to everyone at the grocery store, and so it bums me out that my kids won't get to meet her and all those things.
Speaker 1:I have a whole slew of emotions that go with that. But one of the darkest parts of that for me is the light that she shined everywhere she went is not going to be there anymore. All those rooms, all those people she'd passed, that's just gone for and years, uh, for not really a good reason. You know so my point. You know the time and effort that goes into this. If somebody hears a story from you or me or a guest, you know it's not it's not me, it's not me making it happen, it's a connection to you know either the guest or something they hear. And if just one person you know chooses to make a different decision, have a conversation, go to the chaplain call 988,. You know chooses to make a different decision, have a conversation, go to the chaplain call 988,. You know, go through one of those things.
Speaker 2:You know the hours that are put into it are just minuscule to saving a single person sharing that and I will say you know just what struck me while you were explaining it is you were kind of mentioned a lot of like the positivity she brought. That's no longer in the world. I would argue to say you've kind of it's living through you now. You know, I know that's not the best outcome, obviously right. But I would argue to say it's the positivity still there.
Speaker 1:It's just been handed off to you and and you're clearly, you know, doing it now okay, um, whoo yeah we're gonna move into I'm interviewing you, okay, so to you know, push the the spotlight back over to you near-death experience. What happened and what did you learn?
Speaker 2:Okay, near-death experience was myocarditis brought on by the flu mist vaccine. This is before vaccines were all controversial. If there's one that should have been controversial, it's the flu mist, okay, because we don't use it anymore and there's a reason should have been controversial. It's the flu mist okay, because we don't use it anymore and there's a reason for that, right? Um, but it shouldn't have almost killed a healthy male in his early 20s, right? Like, if it's going to kill anyone, it's going to be someone too young or too old or or someone that is, uh, pregnant, shouldn't get it A lot of those high risk factor type of folks, but not a 23 year old dude, right, that should not hurt that person at all. But it almost killed me. And it wasn't just. I would argue to say it wasn't just the flu mist, right, it was that internally, I basically stopped wanting to be alive. I didn't want to. I never thought about hurting myself or anything, but looking back and after all this time I can reflect on that really dark time in my life. I did not want to be alive and I was abusing alcohol religiously, I mean, every day, just trying to feel nothing, just trying to ignore everything. I was just so disappointed in myself and how I just I felt like a failure. I was about to separate from the military. I was in a career that made me very unhappy. I had no money, tons of debt, I was an alcoholic, I had no school, so I didn't take advantage of any of the benefits that I could have easily had through being an airman and my enlistment was coming up. Now I could either separate worse than going home with my tail between my legs, a failure or re-enlist into something I hate and be miserable in the cycle. I was in a lose-lose, like there was. No, I was not looking forward to my future. I didn't want that future. I didn't want either one of those paths to exist. Therefore, I didn't want to exist.
Speaker 2:And so, you know, I was prescribed Ambien and I know you're not supposed to drink with that. Well, I still was, because really I was hoping that I could just go to sleep and not wake up like that. I would have been okay with that, had no mentor, didn't know anyone was isolating, you know, just gaming, not wanting to get out and talk to anyone. And the more I isolated, not wanting to get out and talk to anyone, and the more I isolated like the deeper and farther. I went down that really horrible path.
Speaker 2:Once I got that flu mist, I felt like I was having a heart attack. I thought something was really wrong with my heart, which was terrifying. I tried to go up a flight of stairs collapsed. But being in maintenance with like tough it out, I was even scared to like bring it up because they were going to like say no and poke fun at me and stuff. But after I fell down on the stairs I was like okay, something is serious. Like so I told them about you know that my heart, my chest, was hurting. Luckily they took that seriously, didn't give me a hard time or anything.
Speaker 2:I called the appointment line. They're like yeah, you got to go to the ER. And I'm like what? It's probably just like a chest cold. They're like no, you got to go to the ER. I go to the ER. They hook up an EKG. They're like yeah, you need to go to Kansas City. I'm like wait, why? Like according to this EKG, like you could die. I'm like what the? So I go from? Like it just happens so fast, I swear within like a few hours. Like I'm in a like this hospital gown with all the stuff hooked to me in Kansas city with the doctor telling me family should fly out Like this all happened within hours of me showing up and I'm just like, am I going to die right now?
Speaker 2:Like this is crazy. And so my dad did fly out and it's one of those viruses that either kills you or goes away. I mean, there's really nothing in between, they just make you comfortable. I didn't know. I was like, just give me antibiotics or something. They're like no, what you have is. And I felt like a freak in there too, because everyone was really old except me in that ward, and so I had all these students coming by to interview me every day when I'm like I could die, and y'all are just questioning me for your freaking studies. This is crazy. But my dad came out and I was. I think my dad coming out saved my life, because I was again in such a dark place. I could have just died at that point. I could have just not made it, because I feel like, because I internally didn't want to live, that probably dropped my immune system and that I feel like the mind is a powerful thing, right, if you want to die there's going to be physical consequences to that state of mind, right.
Speaker 2:But when my dad came out, I was just so relieved that I wasn't in that shop and I was spending time with my dad just me and him and that was enough to make me want to live again, and it, ultimately, is what I think saved my life. Like, although I was in this hospital, at least I got to hang out with him and we got quality time together and I wasn't dealing with all that chaos that was driving me nuts and making me not want to live anymore. I got to get a break from that in a way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that makes sense. A little break, you know you were able to, you know, focus on other things and kind of that wake up moment. I feel like it reminds me of the guy I missed him out at kadena, but the guy that jumped off the golden gate bridge and ended up surviving. He tells that story like as soon as his hands left the railing. He was like I regretted it, but it was like too late at that point. So usually like the wake up or, I guess, closer to death unfortunately, and it's like maybe this could be real, which is sad. That has to come to that. But I'm glad you got back on track and you're still here.
Speaker 2:that wasn't my, that wasn't my rock bottom. Oh, you want to go down that road I? I just say that because I think it's an important message, because that rock bottom could be death right, like I was waiting for a rock bottom to turn my life around. I think a lot of people feel that way, like well, something's got to give you know, maybe I'm going to, you know, get into an accident or hurt myself.
Speaker 2:Something's got to give for me to turn my life around, because I can't keep doing this. And I have to say I had it all wrong. That did not turn my life around. Rock bottom, quote, unquote could be you passing away. There could be nothing negative to turn you around. That might not exist for right, for some, because the problem's still there. Right, I got better, but guess what? All those problems I told you about, all those worries I had, were still there. So you could imagine my disappointment when I swore I'd never drink again. I'm good, I had all this convalescent leave, I'm good, I'm clear. And then, a week after being back at work, I'm throwing up in my sleep from drinking. You could imagine how much I hated myself in that moment. If I can't even listen to my own standards I set for myself, if I can't even follow that, you end up hating yourself. It's almost worse the second time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, with every misstep, when you swear something's never going to happen again, you lose respect for yourself and you just hate yourself over time, because you let yourself down over and over and over again, and so there's a lot that happened between then and now, because you're talking, that was like 2010, around that time. But the message that I wanted to pass, though, is that I was waiting for a rock bottom. That is the wrong way to look at it. I ended up changing through people who cared about me, actually connecting with people and having people support me and have my back in building really meaningful relationships that led to me getting a lot of success and empowerment and encouragement and taking chances on myself.
Speaker 2:It was kind of a domino effect of positivity and positive people in my life, so it was actually putting things in my life slowly, including habits and getting out of my comfort zone and being vulnerable and having meaningful conversations to getting this job, which gets you that job, which it just went up and up and up when, the whole time, I thought I had to go down, down, down, to change, if that makes sense. So that's why I told that story. Yeah, I was thinking of it the opposite way, and I just didn't realize I had to go up. It would just take a while, it would be baby steps, but eventually I was a totally different person in a totally different life.
Speaker 1:So you have a good friend that has an example I forget exactly what it's called like the two-inch domino or something what's his name.
Speaker 2:Oh, there it is, sully.
Speaker 1:Sully.
Speaker 2:That's a great example. You got to start with the little stuff. Yeah, he talks about he hands out out dominoes. He's always got dominoes on him, um, to hand out and to tell stories like as they come up, like he's very, he can take any inanimate object and create a lesson around it. It's, it's unbelievable.
Speaker 2:But yeah, his two-inch decision is basically like that little domino knocks over something bigger, which knocks over something bigger, which knocks over something bigger. Eventually it can knock over the biggest building in the world in a much shorter time than you realize. Right, it doesn't take a million of those steps. It's like 10 to 12 when it's knocking down huge buildings. And the whole point of it is those little steps is what changes your life. It's not one event, it's not one habit, it's micro decisions that cumulatively add up over time that put you in a different place in life. It's that consistency, even with the little things, and a lot of people they don't follow through on the little things. They don't think it matters, they're waiting for maybe that big thing, that big opportunity, that big change, and that stuff doesn't stick. You need the consistency, you need those two-inch decisions and that will change your trajectory over time.
Speaker 2:So shout out to Sully. Absolutely, that's good.
Speaker 1:Good, good advice. I hope someone takes that and makes that two-inch decision. Someone asks you some questions about the podcast. How did you come up with the artwork, the name and the concept of the hero's gong?
Speaker 2:okay. So, um, the name is a double meaning. One of the meetings is everyone has a hero inside and through meaningful conversation I try to bring that to the front lines of our life. So it's the idea that everyone has it in them to be great. It's in all of us and I want to help people find that, because I found that in me when I thought it was impossible. I thought it was worthless. So I'm trying to help people find that inner hero, remind them that it's there and bring it to the front of their life. So that's kind of the spiritual meaning of it. The literal meaning of it is it's actually named after the honor guard.
Speaker 2:They look like heroes at the front of every ceremony and parade. The logo is a play off the Hap Arnold symbol which is on the honor guardsman's hats. Yeah, no one's actually asked me that before.
Speaker 2:So, I'm glad you did. And the gauntlet, the hero's gauntlet, so I actually stole that from someone. When you're creating content, there's certain things that inspire you, that you want to incorporate. Most of the stuff that I do, or anyone does, is things that they've seen somewhere else and they take bits and pieces of that and kind of put it together Right. I mean, content is meant to inspire you into action, so it makes sense that there's certain things that you'd want to adapt to. But I used to save quite random questions for the end.
Speaker 2:Most people don't listen up to the end of a podcast. They'll listen to bits and pieces throughout, but most never listen straight through to the end, unfortunately. And I would ask these really good questions at the end. And I was like man. After I heard that statistic. I was like I can't do it at the very end. No one's even listening to that, potentially. And so there's this guy named Trip Bodenheimer. He's a master sergeant. He runs the Shadows podcast. I listened to his because he was another airman podcaster like me and he started like three months before me. So we started right around the same time and he asked him at the very front, right out the front, and I was like man. I like that. That's actually more engaging to me, and so I took that philosophy from him and I've used it ever since Awesome.
Speaker 1:How do you choose guests and topics? You get your inbox going and whatnot. What catches your attention?
Speaker 2:Okay. So that is a tough one for me Because that changes over time. It's going to start with you asking everybody because no one knows you exist. So you're asking friends and family and you really start with that and people that If you like storytelling, you probably remember people's stories from your past. So you have them come on and share those stories I know I did that and it turns into people lining up to come on. Once.
Speaker 2:I'd say for me it was like the two-year mark. That's when people started asking to come on and I'm like a people pleaser so I never knew how to handle that very well. I'm just being honest. So I'd say whoever bugs me the most gets on. I'm projected out till I project six months out and I don't take anyone until I clear that six months and then I'll project again, because it just gets too much after six months. That's a ridiculous amount of time to plan something, I think. So I'm booked, like right now, till August and I said that's enough, but I make sure that I leave room for in-person podcasts. So I talk to someone once every two weeks and I leave that week in between in case I can meet up with someone in person, because that's my favorite type of podcast interview to have is in person, and I go to Black Rifle, like you've seen, and host in there.
Speaker 2:And then, when you come here, we can replicate that and have one in person.
Speaker 2:So I'd say the guests, I'd say it's a lot of people who I know had incredible stories and I know they had not really shared those stories. They might've just told me and a few other people, and I know people need to hear these stories. Who's coming to mind right now is Jeremy Rutherford, who is my fellow honor guardsman, who went through a ton of traumatic stuff and no one really knows that and he's such an amazing guy. He's borderline, a genius, such an intriguing guy and I'm like man, you got to share that story. Man, you're just such an incredible dude.
Speaker 2:Your story would touch so many people and it did. It really did. And since that story had a lot to do with his family, it made his family really emotional and they had some healthy dialogue because he was able to talk about those things Specifically with him. It was losing his best friend and his biological little brother to suicide when they were going to take on the world together. They lived together and they were going to do everything together and then he came home and he was gone. How do you move on from that? Your whole life is turned upside down now Everything you imagined is gone. How do you move on? And I thought people needed to hear that. But yeah, I think that's the exact purpose.
Speaker 2:I have ADHD. So again, if you bug me enough, you'll get on.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that's like the whole purpose behind you know, this show and whatnot is trying to be able to connect with people like we had talked about, cause you don't want to go to someone that's been perfect or has never had any experiences and things. When you're in those low times you want to find somebody you know you don't want to hear the it'll be okay, this, this too, shall pass. Like you know, the best chance I think you have of connecting is someone that has been through something similar. Not, you know, no one's going to ever have gone through the exact same thing, but, like, if you're in that low, real dark spot, like I think the best chance you have at a connection is going to be probably someone that's been through. So getting that story out is super important. So that's good stuff.
Speaker 2:Everyone who asked to come on, I will say, always has some crazy unique. It's like I a lot most of mine. I have no idea I've never even talked to that person in my life that when you see the episode, that is the first time I've ever talked to him and, uh, I only go off three topics, so sometimes it's so vague I don't even know where the conversation's going. But I feel like it makes for a good conversation because I'm a curious person who loves asking questions and so me not knowing ahead of time almost makes it better because of the types of questions I'll ask.
Speaker 1:That's good stuff. As a fellow podcaster, what have been some of your most rewarding experiences so far? It's tough, right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it is tough. I'd say a couple of the really cool ones that I'm just super thankful for. I would say you meet certain people that really appreciate what you do and when you link up with them, finally they will make magic happen in your life. And for me, that person was Kate Hewlett. I gave her a three-part series because she has an incredible story and has just had my back like no other. But through her friendship I was able to interview Lieutenant General Slife, who's going to be the next Vice Chief of Staff of the air force.
Speaker 2:Um, a three-star general who's active duty, who came on my pocket like that's, that's insane to me. Um, you know, just knowing how I started in the adversity that I had and the people trying to stop me and threaten me to a three-star general sitting right across from me in person, was surreal. But I'm so thankful that you know that happened because, like I was thinking like, first of all, if we could figure out how much he gets paid an hour, how much would I owe him for that? You know what I mean A thousand dollars.
Speaker 1:Yeah, probably $800 at least. Wow, that's crazy An hour.
Speaker 2:Probably $800 at least. Wow, that's crazy An hour. But I was thinking I never in my life thought I could sit down with a general and have a one-hour transparent and candid discussion. Never in my life did I think that would happen. And how many people get to know? When he becomes the Vice Chief of Staff of the Air Force? Potentially? Now people are going to know who he is as a person. How unique is that? You know what I mean. They're taking a normal person like me who's going to ask the same questions you would ask and what you're curious about, and now thousands of people are going to know what he's all about. And I just thought, man, that is really cool concept like not only I get to have a conversation with him, but thousands of other people do too. And now we know who's leading us, now we know what he's all about. I thought that was just so unique.
Speaker 2:And I'd say another one is just the messages I get that I don't often share. I get a lot of messages about people that felt alone, people that wanted to end their life or people that thought they were the only one that experienced a certain problem. Hit me up and just say thank you and I'm just like wow, it's crazy when someone tells you the impact that that conversation had on their life. That will never get old to me, that will always be super special to me. And the other special thing I will say is just the friendships that you make through the journey. Now, me and you are always going to be linked up from this point on because we've had a conversation. It just widens your circle to incredible people that you otherwise would have never ran into or spoken to, but now you have them in your life.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's awesome. I can't imagine those thank you notes. If you're having a rough morning, you haven't got your coffee yet, you're not feeling like you're having a good day, and then you get a thank you like that day is just automatically awesome, maybe that week, maybe you know that month. That's awesome. I do want to ask a question, kind of in light of that how do you get over the fear of starting something released publicly that you know people are going to criticize?
Speaker 2:You just have to embrace yourself. Well, first of all, you should know boundaries right, especially if you're a uniformed service member. You need to talk to someone who's done it before and be like hey, what's worked for you and what hasn't? I think that that is super important. I didn't have that and I did make some mistakes and I did pay for those mistakes that did happen. That's why I stay away from comedy to this day.
Speaker 1:It wasn't funny, I guess.
Speaker 2:Well, that's the thing about comedy is that it's going to piss someone off, right?
Speaker 1:It was funny to someone, just not funny to somebody else.
Speaker 2:If it pisses off one wrong person, that's it. That's it. That's a bad day, okay, so I stay away from comedy. So I think it's really important to get feedback from those that are already doing it, and that's hard sometimes. Sometimes you feel intimidated, sometimes you are too proud to do that. But the podcast community and the veteran community is so. They welcome you with open arms and that's what I love about it. I'm so sick of competing in the Air Force that I love that in this setting, the more we help each other, the more we all benefit from it, and I love that. I love that it's not like oh, I talked to this person and you didn't talk to her and I got this many views. No one does that. You know what I?
Speaker 1:mean Just all in it together.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're all in it together. We all help each other, and it's such a positive thing in my life. If I'm having a bad day, I can always hop on here, and it would just cheer me right up. I forgot what you asked, though. What did you?
Speaker 1:ask. I asked how do you deal with you know, kind of opening yourself up like at the beginning? I mean, you're a couple years in now, but at the beginning were you worried like this thing is going out to the internet. That is out there and do you check the comments or do? You just let it run well, here's the thing you.
Speaker 2:You can outlast those haters. They gave up, bro. After two years they gave up. I don't see it anymore. I know I hear about it through hey. I talked to this guy and he thought this was dumb that you did that. I hear that occasionally but, like the negative comments or people yelling at me, I don't see it anymore because they realize it's not going to work at me or what. I don't see it anymore because they realize it's not going to work. So you can outlast the adversity. They will get tired and they will give up because you're not going anywhere and also, that's like 1% right, everyone's going to be on board with your positive message. That's the reality. Those few people who cares that's a very small percentage of people in your circle. Most will support you.
Speaker 2:We had seven active duty funerals, so that's a very unexpected passing of a service member. When that happens, they're active duty at the time and you're standing there for over an hour just hearing person after person speak about this service member. Meanwhile you're feet away from the family having the worst moment of their life, crying the whole time, bawling their eyes out, and I remember thinking in a few of those moments. It's so intense that I almost feel like if I take one step, I'm going to pass out.
Speaker 2:It is that intense of an environment and I remember thinking man, if I can just emotionally get through this, if I can give this person this flag, give the message of condolence and give them the best honor guard service that they'll remember forever, if I can do that, then I can do literally anything. Nothing will be harder than this right now Nothing, and that's the truth. After being comfortable being able to be there for those people in their darkest times and to do that and not let it break me, I feel like nothing can really shake me. After that, I got through it. I challenged myself. I was there for people in their darkest hour. I got some more gray hair for it, absolutely, but I'm a better person because of that experience.
Speaker 1:That's awesome. I want to back up and touch on one thing. Really reminded me of Todd Simmons. He was my command chief at Edwards alongside General Teicher. It's now retired, or I guess they're both retired, but he sponsored the influencers to go to AFSA and be able to do that, and so that's a good example. It's kind of backing up to your previous thought. But that thought of if we do good stuff we can do it together, I don't. I really have a hard time grasping the like stepping on others to rise yourself up. A lot of times if we come together we do better than we ever could have alone. So I love that you brought that up and so I had to foot stomp that we're. We're better together.
Speaker 2:Definitely, and I'll tell you, a benefit of that AFSA experience, where we all came together, was that we all realized or at least I did. I realized that we're all totally different, right, which is great, because now, like, how wide is that net? It's huge nerd, and you don't want to hear what I have to say. You might want to go to the Shadows podcast and you think Trip Bodenheimer is the man right. At least, if they don't like one of us, they'll probably like another.
Speaker 2:The amount of variety was tremendous. We were all just so different and I think that's the point Todd was trying to make Look how different they are, but look at them when they're together, look at how strong that force is, and that to make you know. Look how different they are, but look at them when they're together, look at, look at how strong that force is, and that to me. A lot of people said that that was the highlight of their whole AFSA experience was meeting us and being able to talk to us and be interviewed and and and the positivity and the conversations, and it was exciting. It was really exciting, and a lot of people said that that was the highlight of their whole trip.
Speaker 1:That's awesome Good stuff. Todd, number one command chief in my book Um having the number having the 2022 veteran podcasts of the year. What advice do you have for someone who is interested in starting their own? There it is Wow. It kind of plays into what you were just talking about. How does someone find their unique voice and audience?
Speaker 2:So for me personally, it was being comfortable in my own skin and realizing that I have to work for that. Anyone that you meet in your life who's like man, that person's just them. They're just them. They're comfortable, nothing's bothering them. I wish I had confidence like that. How do they do that? Well, a lot of them at least that they're not delusional had to work for that and they respect themselves right. They've earned respect for themselves.
Speaker 2:I told you I used to hate myself Back at that time. I couldn't have a conversation like this. I'd be stuttering, I'd have shortness of breath, I'd be downright terrified. I could not talk to people, period dot. I had a stutter and everything. You think I have asthma. People thought I had asthma. I actually told them I did because I was so embarrassed that I was that anxious.
Speaker 2:It's true it was that bad, but it was from all those bad habits and never, ever getting out of my comfort zone or doing anything unless I was drunk, like if I was drinking. Okay, now I'll talk to that person or do that, and then when you don't have that, you're a mess. You don't know who you are. So you have to do it at a time in your life where you're comfortable with yourself. That's my opinion. I mean, if you're comfortable in your own skin and you know you've made progress in your own life and you feel like that could value someone else, I feel like that would be a really good time to start. If mental health is the focus of the podcast.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and another thing I would argue that having some nervousness is important. I really wanted to interview Chief Woods. He's a big personality, he's a fun guy and I'd wanted to. I was nervous, I wasn't sure if I could do it and he was leaving that week. He got the short notice assignment. He's like I'm out of here and so I hit him up on Facebook because he's a super cool dude and so cool. He even runs his own Facebook for the command chief page and whatnot, which I thought was cool Not the execs, but him.
Speaker 1:I was like can I get in there? And he's like can you be here, basically now. So I fly in, I set all my stuff up in the wing building. I've never set up outside of my house before and I'm huffing, I'm puffing because I'm like grabbing stuff and I'm completely freaked out because it's like my second or third one and I'll probably always remember. He said if you didn't, if it wasn't important to you, you would not care. You're nervous and you're short of breath because this is important to you and it's something that matters and so you should have a little bit of.
Speaker 1:I mean not that you need to act like you got asthma, but maybe that's a little too extreme.
Speaker 1:But I think a little bit of that is care, if not just wing it. You know, don't do very good, don't be professional, but I think there should be a little bit. I mean, I'm nervous. I'm here with you and I was like I'm talking to Josh today, hero front, this is big, but yeah, you just got to get in there and get after it. So how to get in there and get after it so? But we'll move on.
Speaker 2:I'll say doing it over and over again. Obviously that helps. But I'll say preparation, that's huge, right. My favorite thing to do honestly, is, if you did a podcast before as a guest, I will listen to that a few times before I talk to you, because now I know your cues, I know how to ask a different question that wasn't already asked. Like, if you feel prepared in yourself and with the guest, then it's going to be a much easier experience for you. Just trying to wing it, though sometimes that doesn't work out, yeah, definitely.
Speaker 1:That's definitely true. So I got one last question for you, looking ahead. I think you kind of touched on this on LinkedIn a little bit but what are your future plans and aspirations? What do?
Speaker 2:you got going on for the podcast and I'm talking to you and you put me in a great mood. But I've been bummed out lately. I'm not going to lie, because I was so close to being a podcaster for the Air Force. I was going to be a part of the resiliency office at the Pentagon. So many people, including the office itself, wanted this to happen and for me, I grew up a problem child. My parents were divorced. No one had faith in me. I was like an underdog my whole life.
Speaker 2:My dad worked at the Pentagon at the end of his career. I was there on 9-11. I saw the Pentagon. I lived in that area.
Speaker 2:So spiritually it was like if I could end there at this building that I never thought I was worthy for that. No one ever thought that I would ever reach because they thought I was some problem child. And my dad worked there. I I just spiritually. It just meant so much to me. But to also take everything I've ever learned and help the entire Air Force with that message and empower people with all the ideas I have, the conversations I've had, the multiple careers I've had and I could leave pouring all that. I would have left it all on the field and I would have just rode off into the sunset after that just feeling so accomplished, such an amazing ending to my career, and I was convinced it was going to happen. I mean, even at AFSA I got to talk to every power player I could and I've never asked for anything in my career, but I thought this was worth it. I thought this needed me to. I needed to know I did everything I could to secure this spot, but because of the way the system set up, no matter how they felt about it or how much they tried or who they talked to, it couldn't happen. It just could not happen. And someone completely at random will be sitting in that chair. Oh yeah, it came down to Is that a legal thing? What is that the whole thing? What is it?
Speaker 2:The way the position was designed was not ideal for handpicking someone. The way the position was designed ended up coming down to who had the most time on station out of all the applicants. So whoever's been at their base the longest was going to get put in that hot seat. And even when I found that out, I even tried to like tell them about that. Like hey, I talked to her mentor. Like this is not going to happen because of this. They could not. They could not make it happen as as best, as much as they wanted it to, we couldn't figure it out. And we were on a time crunch because by the time they pick someone, it's over. And crunch because by the time they pick someone, it's over. And AFPC picked it.
Speaker 2:You couldn't believe how I felt when I logged in and saw denied it used to say pending, and then it said denied. And I've just been crushed from that. I'm having to rethink my whole future now because I was so set on doing that. I felt like God was pointing me to that. With everything I've been through, I thought that was the sign, this was the door I was pointing me to, that, with everything I've been through, I thought that was the sign, this was the door I was supposed to go through. And for it to close, I'm kind of just left wondering what the hell I'm going to do with my life now. And so I'm back.
Speaker 2:You saw me back on LinkedIn like hey, I'm a free agent again. What's up, what's out there? So, professionally, I want to do something that's meaningful. I want to do something that has a lot of purpose and a place where I can exercise all of my unique talents that bring me joy to even be able to exercise. In my current situation I can't exercise anything I enjoy I'm in management. It's stats, it's slides. Anything I enjoy I'm in management, it's stats, it's slides, it's Excel spreadsheets. It's nothing that I want to do forever so professionally. I hope, wherever I land, it's full of purpose, I'm exercising my strengths and it's bringing me joy. Podcast-wise, I just want to keep taking those baby steps. I'm going to take baby step after baby step after baby step and with the positive messages, the incredible people I talk to, the incredible stories and connections that are getting out there, I want to grow that as large as I possibly can because it's the most fun, amazing and purposeful experience I've ever had in my life.
Speaker 1:It's a blast A lot of work in the background, but it's a great time. Finally, what message or takeaway do you hope listeners will take from today's podcast?
Speaker 2:I think what they should take is Because when I won that 12 Outstanding Airmen of the Year Award, people were talking to me like, oh, you did everything right. Why should I listen to you? You've never been through hard times and, of course, you know my story, so that kind of made me like really dude. So I hope the one thing they take away would be anyone could make something of themselves. We all have it in us. We all have it in us Because I was a person who wanted to die, who almost died, who had nothing, no money, no friendships, no school, just debt and depression and bad habits.
Speaker 2:And that person, who should be buried right now somehow is now living his best life through a lot of hard work and a lot of baby steps. And if anyone ever wants to talk to me about that one-on-one, please put them in touch with me. But the message would be no matter where you're at in life, you still have time to turn it around. I turned my whole life around in one year. I thought that was impossible, but when I look back, my whole life changed in one year of positive decisions. One year, everything changed. So don't doubt what you can do in one year. That's awesome.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I always try to push that out too. I know, you know I've been through a divorce and, you know, try to share custody of my daughter. My dad passed away and my grandma passed away and all these things, you know. And I would never want this crappy situation to not be used for good. If it sucks and I don't use it or get to connect with somebody, or you know, use it for some type of good, then it just sucked to suck. That's not any fun with somebody. Or you know, use it for some type of good, then it just sucked to suck. That's not any fun. If it sucked, I hope at some later point not to compare or anything like that to anyone else, but to just be there and have the empathy and the connection to be like, yeah, something happened, it wasn't good, but I'll be here for you. I mean, that's what makes the bad times, you know, worth it. If not, what was the point of having a bad time? So that's absolutely true.
Speaker 2:Yeah, man, you need to talk to David Nordell. He has that exact same philosophy. Like you have a story, even if it's negative, like you need to, it's your responsibility to use that to help someone else, like that's his whole. He wrote a whole book around that philosophy, so yeah, awesome.
Speaker 1:I'll have to check it out. Absolutely Well I encourage listeners to get out there, share their thoughts. Let me know how it is. Let me know, uh, feedback, improvements, hit me up on social media or email. Let me know if you want to talk to Josh or figure out some other stuff. But, uh, thank you much for coming out, Josh. I appreciate you a lot for more than just this episode and, yeah, we'll get the links and everything posted for yours and mine and I just want to say I love you all. Anything else.
Speaker 2:Josh, have blown me away with your story, what you've been through and how you reached out to me and then seeing you actually doing it now, and I know how much joy that's going to bring you and so many people that listen and I just want to give you a shout out and just say I'm insanely proud of you. I know what it takes to start something like this and I'm just super excited to like see what you do with it and where it goes.
Speaker 1:Sounds good, we'll have a good night. Yeah, you too, man, see ya, thank you you.
